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Intake upgrades -Airbox


 
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OFF RD
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 21:14    Post subject: Intake upgrades -Airbox Reply with quote

Hey guys, curiosity got the best of me this week and finally got into upgrading my air intake.  Many of sleepless nights wondering where to start, and after allot of hmmmmng, and ahhhhhng I decided in the first instance the intake Airbox/Air filter was where to start. And the most part the actual intake into the box was my pick, looking at the rest of the piping to the throttle body etc looked pretty good with a bell mouth on the top of the box.  Again if any pressure drop there would be some here as the engine will empty the box of air and struggle to fill from clean ambient air.  A test should be done with a man-o-meter but from experience this showed the signs of starvation.


Note the foam tape I have put up on the underside of the box.  I have tried sealing this box airtight now which have found this has fixed a flat spot I used to get when taking off, the k+N filter must be thinner and not seal off.  Anyway, the risk though is drawing cool air still, preventing detonation, rule of thumb is every 7 degrees temp above ambient temp is 1hp lost, so if your sucking air straight from under the bonnet it is a recipe for disaster.  So I wondered whether I should redo the existing intake or add another intake into the box drawing cool air from somewhere.  This is what took all the thought.  So I made a decision to draw air from the headlight tuck hard in almost where the factory one draws in from beside the radiator.  Put in a secondary intake so for what ever reason I could close it back off with an alluminium plate if it all turns to custard.  Also with drawing air from behind the headlight there is still a risk of drawing under bonnet air when sitting in peak hour traffic so keeping the factory intake aswell ensures we do still get some cooler air, which is another point I'll point out.

I went to a local hardware store and picked up 2 PVC 45degree bends cost $14.00.  I would normally go with a 75mm/3" pipe but seen I did want to draw from the factory intake aswell I chose 65mm instead giving a total now 6" intake into the box now.  Also note using PVC you can heat it, push it over a funnel and you get a good flowing bell mouth on the pipe.  Don't under estimate the need to do this.  You will be surprised....



I' Ve used some Teflon thread tape around the pipe to get a good seal, I may replace this with black insulation tape to hide it a little bit more.  Care must be taken when drilling the hole out, there is no turning back.  A file, Dremel and sandpaper cleaned it up nicely.  The pipe holds its own weight and wedges in nice and tight.  It seems to have a pretty clear airflow from the headlight

I have noticed a great improvement, power sits solid through the mivec band between 5-6500rpm, there's more bottom end power and when the mivec kicks in its not such a kick, it's more smooth. Yaaaahoooo.
But, again I need to stress, I have made some assumptions. 1) am I drawing cool air? 2) is it actually flowing more?  For number 2 I have no doubt, but for number 1) I need to test. I am searching for a baby bath temp reader which has the diode on a wire so we can measure the temps from the cabin and doesn't cost the earth. But for now real happy. Laughing
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OFF RD
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 21:36    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh and it pops hard now when you ease off the gas!  Shocked
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Rob546454
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 1:50    Post subject: Reply with quote

Impressive. Seems like you know your stuff with air intakes. I have learned a lot with many different trial and error setups on different cars.

Despite what most people say heat soak is still a killer on turbo engines. People tend to chat utter *beep* when it comes to air intakes; especially ones that haven't actually tried it in reality, which is frustrating.

Manufacturers spend a lot of money trying to utilize what space there is in the engine bay to balance optimum performance with the required sound baffling for a standard car. Most of the time if there are any gains to be had; its generally by tweaking the existing design at the expense of the sound baffling. As opposed to sacking off the original design completely and doing what you think is best.

Just because you can make the pipework 30cm shorter doesn't me its going to make any difference, people underestimate the suction power of engines even naturally aspirated ones. Yeh it might not put up much of a fight if you put your hand over the inlet when you are free-revving it. But when you are driving the car and the engine is underload its a different story.
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OFF RD
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:34    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks mate.  Can't argue with science and facts lol

There's so many opinions out there  Rolling Eyes you don't know who to trust.

I did apply what I learnt from building up my other toy

I read a couple books which broke down the techi stuff to lamans terms I could then understand.

Basically a step by step guide how to do it, cost you next to nothing to do.  It then has some dyno sheets they have done on every day cars like Toyota corolla, Subaru wax, Sierra cosworth etc.

It's more obsession and don't trust anyone working on my vehicles and would rather perform as many upgrades myself, you have to be crazy ripping out all the factory parts, like you say, Mitsi spent millions I bet making sure this one flowed well, but prior to selling on the market they had to make it quiet and not sound like its going to suck your cats and dogs up, it would never have sold.  Sacrificed some power baring in mind they wanted to race them anyway and already knew what to do when putting them in the desert.

I also wasted thousands on my car trying to look like everyone else, when theres much more satisfaction doing it your self, getting more power out of the same thing someone else has but looks standard.  I managed 250kw out of my 2ltr 1988 lancer, everyone was saying to put the evo head on so it flows better, I checked the 1988 1.6 turbo head and it was basically same in dimensions, we changed the cams over, bolted it on, factory intake manifold, bored out throttle body, still running factory evo injectors and boom.  The other cars I know similar with big garret turbos getting only 226kw, I still run the factory turbo housing too with a hybrid turbo and it is more than good enough for the job.

I can only hope someone takes my advice lol rather than blowing budgets on a flash chrome pod filter.  The next upgrade I definitely want to pursue is the A/C, again ripped it straight out of my car d u m a s s, but this time may look to utilise the ability to provide cool air.  Throttle body is next, I was hoping to get some sleep this month.

Dan
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Rob546454
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 12:08    Post subject: Reply with quote

All sounds pretty interesting. I too find being a bit money savvy, combined with some ingenuity, creates better and more satisfying modifications than just blindly throwing money into it.

As regards to turbos; i am trying to find out the effect of a hybrid turbo myself as I have a lot of plans that don't seem to have been done before on the diesel engine I have. Im thinking about putting a larger compression wheel and housing on the standard exhaust side. I was hoping you might know, generally speaking, what that kind of turbo upgrade does to power delivery.

Forget the actual power gains obviously. I want to know how that kind of setup will affect the engines power band; Would it give more bottom end power, or would it bog low down and push the power into the top end?
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OFF RD
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 3:17    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep ideal, exhaust housing should be taken into account aswell.  Often vehicles also run similar turbos for different size engines etc, they will have a similar turbine wheel but larger housing so you do both.  Check with a truck wrecker or something and see if there is a bigger turbo in that series you have.

When we built mine, it is really what they call a big 16g (tdo5) with a 20g (tdo6) front wheel.  16g Was the model turbo mitsi used in the late 80's into the 90's, on the early vr4 galant EVO 0, and aswell the EVO3 only came factory with the bigger 16g exhaust housing.  If I remember right the normal 16g had a .6 stamped into the cast, then the big 16g had .7 stamped on the back.  Very rare to find, and I found one in a box of parts a guy had. GOLD.  Everything bolted up the same but it had a bigger exhaust exit so I had to upgrade the exhaust flange etc.

You don't notice the difference really first glance but you put them side by side and they certainly are bigger, they are a straight swap, I had mine ported on the exhst pipe side so they matched 2.5" ex flange, then a reducer up to 3" pipe all the way.  we then had the turbine wheel "back cut" which trimmed the blades back opening up the gaps between them, both mods enabling us to get the exhaust gas out of the engine which is key, boost came on a bit later(created a little lag) but it came in solid through the rev range.

Front wheel will flow more inevitably it enables more boost/power/torque, but if you can't get the exhaust out at the same rate then the turbo is no longer efficient.  Air temps go up and the turbo is spooling out before you actually need the power.

I assume you have done a high flow exhaust?  Waste gate options need to be weighed up aswell.  Once you start cranking more power through the factory turbine side, the internal waste gate may need to be flowed or welded up and you use external.  Depends how much power you want.  Couple issues I found.
After doing the exhaust 3", and put larger airflow meter on, the boost shot straight to 18psi and had boost cut.  There was no way to reduce the boost below 18 without introducing restriction back in.  Stuff that....  This is where I had to go external waste gate to get control back on the boost, custom exhaust manifold made, waste gate, then dialled back to 15psi.  Took to first dyno 220kw atw @ 22psi, I also had a computer put in then so we could get rid of airflow meter.

Had issues tuning due to poor boost controller (t piece and a 1/4 needle valve) so I went got the HKS TYPE S electronic boost controller, this is when I also had the throttle body bored out.  Tune #2 250kw atw @ 22psi.  Controlling the boost is critical lol.  Be careful.... If you run airflow meter, this should be looked at aswell, you'll be surprised.  I had mine rewired to a larger model mitsi one aswell so this can be a cheaper option to get more flow.  It's worth making a man o meter and see if any of your intake is actually no good.  The snorkels you guys run are usually pretty good aye.

Small increase in compressor will work, just how big lol.  Someone on here will no doubt have a combination.  To actually do the mathematics of what you need, would take forever, no joke.  People generally don't do it, and the big corps like garret, HKS etc don't share that info due to their research.  It's no joke.  There is bound to be a larger model turbo on a diesel truck, triton, challenger or something.  A mitsi truck 4x4 wrecker will know exactly.
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OFF RD
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 3:26    Post subject: Reply with quote

garret diesel
Check this out.  If you really want to get into the numbers lol.
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Rob546454
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 3:23    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its all very complicated and alot to try and process. However If I don't go daft with too big of an upgrade i'm hoping I won't have an issue. As for the exhaust I am planning a double system. One standard (albeit slightly derestricted) Then a straight through side exit that I can open with an electronic butterfly valve.
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OFF RD
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 3:21    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah perfect, butterfly is the way to go when you hit off road or whatever.

A die grinder and Dremel on your factory internal wastegate helps gain a bit more control on the boost.  I cleaned all of the exhaust side to help flow the gasses out.

Good luck.
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