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The Mitsubishi Pajero Owners Club® The Mitsubishi Pajero, Shogun, Montero, Challenger, Raider and EVO 4x4 Owner's Club
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DELBOY ****
Joined: 22 Oct 2002 Posts: 258 Location: DURHAM
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Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2002 16:31 Post subject: Why Does my Pajero have two batteries ? |
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can any one tell me why do pajeros have two batteries |
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Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2002 16:31 Post subject: Google Ads keep the POCUK free to join! |
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cyberstace ****
Joined: 10 Oct 2002 Posts: 297 Location: Alton, Hampshire
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Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2002 16:59 Post subject: Batteries |
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My 92 2.5TDI has only one, Super Exceed etc have two, apparently this is to cope with all the extra electric gadgets they have. The system is still 12 volts. |
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Philco Guest
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Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2002 17:04 Post subject: |
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Previous answers to your question
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The vehicle is 12v, There is no need for 24v on the Pajero for starting.( As far as diesels go 2.5L is a toy motor, as an ex diesel mechanic I have only seen 24 v on big gear such as Kenworth trucks.) If the starter was 24v and the rest of the vehicle 12v the positive cables would go to a parallel / series switch to enable the differing voltage. As the batteries are wired in parallel, and are 12v batteries and there is no parallel / series switch the entire vehicle is 12volts.
Why 2 batteries? - easier to carry then 1 big battery, also more capacity (amp hours) better for starting and running electrical appliances with the engine turned off.
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I have a '92 swb Pajero imported from Japan that stopped working today due to alternator problem. MMC are attempting to rectify the problem but it give me a good chance to have the 2 batteries explained. It seems both arguments that have been raised in here are sort of correct.
It does indeed have a 24 volt starting system as most military diesel vehicles do. The starting system uses both batteries to start the engine then the charging system recharges both batteries. The 2 battery option is only used in countries where temperature extremes occur. It is possible to convert a 2 battery into 1 but it does require drastic re-wiring of both starting system, alternator and charging circuit. The problem with the 2 battery system is that it requires a 90amp alternator to charge both batteries (standard shogun has a 75 amp) These 90 amp are very difficult to get hold of and I have had to get MMC to recondition my old one at a cost of £300 and the loss of my transport for about a week.
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sorry to make your simple question turn into a full scale debate, but I must still disagree with Sean, this is my second twin battery Pajero and i also ran the other one with just one battery fitted for some time with no adverse effect and every thing working normally, I see that Si has also replied disagreeing with the 24volt starting idea, i work at Manchester airport and we have tried starting a 24 volt system crane from a 12volt battery and it wont even turn the engine over, as for damage to the starter i can only see this being possible if you were to try and start a 12volt system with 24 volts, but using 12volts for a 24 volt system just gives the symptoms of a flat battery which will not harm the starter. I will speak to MMC myself tomorrow and get back to you.
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More info from MMC:
as promised, I have today spoken with the MMC dealer in Warrington, they confirm it is a 12 volt system, they even looked up part no. for my Pajero starter:- md164977 2.2k/watt cost £160 exchange and for a similar aged shogun (with one battery) md164976 2.2k/watt cost £155 exchange, the parts manager said the one digit difference in part no. and slight difference in price would be due to the manufacturer of the starter, same as we get here could be lucas or ac/delco or unipart etc. also if you read the owners manual page 354 specification electrical system it states voltage 12 volts, and for batteries it gives an option 1x95d31r or 95d31rx2 if the system required two batteries it would be standard fit and not listed as an option!
I have also physically traced the positive cables from both my batteries and they both go to the same terminal on the starter motor so there is no way the voltage can be upped to 24volts, so with all the information being thrown at you Neil you will have to make up your own mind, hope this helps.
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I have since spoken to Mitsubishi regarding twin battery set up and have been advised it is for starting the vehicle only and also it can damage the starter motor etc if started on 12 volts only, so Mr Leckenby has given potentially damaging advice - be warned!
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I had to have my 1990 Pajero Electrics checked and was told that the reason for 2 batteries was 24 volt starting and then reverted to 12 volt for normal use. Asked for proof and was shown 24 volts at the starter.
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Looking under there would make you think that, but they are linked in parallel, as both earth out on the inner wheel arch, so you get more power from both batteries. e.g if you have two 110Ah batteries, they will be linked to give you 220Ah so therefore better for starting the engine and will also give twice the duration for allowing lights etc to be used, this also takes load from the alternator as the batteries don't have to recover as much, meaning the alternator doesn't have to put out high charge for as long.
They are not linked in to form 24v, as if they were, when you operated the starter, all the other electrical systems would go to 24v too, resulting in smoking stereos etc!
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sorry to say but Sean's reply is not correct. I have a 1993 2.5td lwb exceed with twin battery setup. The reason the later 2.5 Pajero's have two batteries is because it's available as an optional extra, we all know our Japanese buddies like all the accessories and extras they can get, lets be honest that's one of the reasons we buy these vehicles instead of a Shogun.
I have removed one of my batteries to temporarily use on my caravan, and used the car for a few days with no problem starting and all the electrics still working, another suggestion was that two batteries were fitted because of all the electrical gadgets fitted to the exceed model. this is also not true extra electrical load is taken care of by the heavy duty 90 amp/hr alternator that is fitted in place of the standard 65 or 75 amp/hr alternator.
The reason twin battery option is available is for use in extreme cold or remote locations , but as stated earlier its an option so the Japs have it fitted.
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your 2.5 td is 24 volt starting and 12 volt everything else, the one with just two big cables attached to it is the 2nd battery for starting |
Enlighting and confusing.......now you know |
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DELBOY ****
Joined: 22 Oct 2002 Posts: 258 Location: DURHAM
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Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2002 20:05 Post subject: bad head |
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thanks for the help lads but now my head hurts iam going for a lie down in a dark room |
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paul_jefferson ****
Age: 48 Zodiac: Joined: 22 Oct 2002 Posts: 314 Location: Denbigh, North Wales
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Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2002 20:18 Post subject: 24/12 Volts??????? |
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I am also curious. I studied electro mechanics for nearly three years, so I will challange my skills tomorow and find out what is going on with the 2 batteries.
Paul |
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Navigatorone *****
Joined: 10 Oct 2002 Posts: 623 Location: The Coast, North Wales
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Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2002 21:13 Post subject: |
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I have two batteries on my Mk 1 Paj. I think it is for more capacity. I do not think it is 24 volt though. |
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paul_jefferson ****
Age: 48 Zodiac: Joined: 22 Oct 2002 Posts: 314 Location: Denbigh, North Wales
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Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2002 21:49 Post subject: |
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I am sure you are right. I can't imagine that you would need 24v in a vehicle like this. I think the Land Cruiser has a 24v start but that is a 4l 6cyl truck engine.
I will however investigate, just out of curiosity. I think the idea behind 2 batteries is for load balancing due to all the gadgets i.e two heater matrixes, air con condenser fans, great big fog lamps super fast cylinder heater plugs and so on. |
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Richie LifeTime Member
Age: 24 Zodiac: Joined: 10 Oct 2002 Posts: 9445 Location: Away
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Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2002 21:53 Post subject: batteries |
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Why two.
Cos there from Japan and kitted out for cold weather climate, two to kick the motor over, only 12 volts, nothing fancy.
Just when it's cold it's bloody cold, I have used mine in Romania and its, double bloody cold over there, and I have never failed to start.
But thats all they are, just for cold weather climate |
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paul_jefferson ****
Age: 48 Zodiac: Joined: 22 Oct 2002 Posts: 314 Location: Denbigh, North Wales
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Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2002 21:56 Post subject: |
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Hi richie.
That makes perfect sense. |
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Philco Guest
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Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2002 22:16 Post subject: |
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I guess the simple answer to 2 batteries is because they are easier to handle than one big one - and you get some bl@@dy big single batteries fitted in 4x4's these days |
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Paul Mayer *
Joined: 29 Oct 2002 Posts: 24 Location: London
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Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2002 13:42 Post subject: Twin Batteries |
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Just to add my 2P worth. I think you will find that the twin battery models also have a little red sticker on the rear of the car with some Japanese writing in it. Having lived there for 6 months, a rough translation is "Cold Weather Equipment" and is primaraly for the Hokkaido market. Hokkaido is the nothern most island in Japan and is nearer Siberia than Tokyo, with winter temperatures reguarly going below -20c, often -30c. As well as the twin batteries (12v through out, as I found out when making enquiries about buying my Delica out there), there is extra insulation and an uprated heating system amongs the extras in the Cold Weather Equipment option pack which I belive is available on any model, regardless of trim level.
Hope this helps,
paul |
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allan *****
Joined: 10 Oct 2002 Posts: 787 Location: Whitstable, Kent
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Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2002 15:17 Post subject: |
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Well, that explains the two battery cars, now, as mine has three batteries, can anybody explain why ?
allan |
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EvilEd *****
Joined: 10 Oct 2002 Posts: 692 Location: St. Nicholas-at-Wade, East Kent
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Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2002 15:50 Post subject: |
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Because you're wearing your watch while driving it.... or do you mean the one in the torch in the toolbox? |
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Navigatorone *****
Joined: 10 Oct 2002 Posts: 623 Location: The Coast, North Wales
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Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2002 17:26 Post subject: |
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If you have got three batteries is there any room under the bonnet for the engine
Keith |
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theboatpainter Guest
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Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2002 22:51 Post subject: |
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Having followed this debate for some time, I thougt as i have got nothing better to do i'll have look at my own batterys Both negative terminals go to chassis, both positive terminals go to the starter motor. this is definately a 12v system |
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